“It’s hell for everyone there: for employees and for convicts.” An interview with former political prisoner and blogger Pavel Spiryn

Photo: Naviny.by

In an interview with Belsat, he revealed that he plans to complete the 2020 revolution and has a concrete plan, and also shared that he witnessed both the humanity of some security forces and the abuse of ordinary prisoners.

Pavel Spiryn is a video blogger, lawyer, and trustee of Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya during the 2020 presidential campaign. He was detained on September 9, 2020, and accused under Part 1, Article 130 of the Criminal Code ("Inciting social hatred"). The reason was Spiryn's films "The Edge" and "The Horrible Secret of the Prosecutor General of Belarus: Carte Blanche for Sadism," published on his YouTube channel. For this, he was sentenced to 4.5 years in a penal colony.

At the end of 2024, as his term was nearing its end, a new criminal case was opened against him – under Article 411 of the Criminal Code ("Malicious disobedience to the administration of a penal colony"). He fully served his sentence and was released on December 28, 2025.

“It’s hell for everyone there: for employees and for convicts”

— How are you now, morally and physically?

— I feel great. I don't have any particular problems. I was released last year, and for about a month, I went to a remote village. I have my own house in the Minsk region. I rested well — rural food, nature, peace. I came to my senses, let's say. I communicated with people through closed channels. Then I moved to Minsk. I stayed in Minsk for a little longer. And then I moved on to continue my "illegal activities."

— While you were imprisoned, was there anything you wanted to do once free — go somewhere, see someone? If so, have you managed to do it yet?

There were no such desires. I wanted to make a revolution. In the penal colony, that was impossible. So, I constantly prepared, wrote, read, studied, and communicated with people. I lived the same life as other convicts. I worked in the colony's cafeteria and was in the same conditions as other people.

— Former political prisoners have recounted terrible things about prisons and penal colonies. What did you have to go through?

— My previous activities saved me. My films and investigations were watched by employees in the penal colonies, too. Since the content was [content. — Ed.] adequate, legally sound, and correct, the views I promoted were also shared by Ministry of Internal Affairs employees.

One must distinguish between Ministry of Internal Affairs employees. There are specific fascists — these are, without exception, all generals of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the Prosecutor's Office, and the Investigative Committee. With them, the conversation will only be based on law. And the law is severe.

There are employees who are on our side, who, risking their ranks, saved people like me. Both non-political and political prisoners. So, of course, they are our support. They read and watch so-called extremist channels, and they watch and consider you [Belsat]. Like everyone else, they are waiting for an window of opportunity to open.

In this regard, it was easier for me. Generals ordered me to be abused. I went through punitive isolation cells, PKT (punishment cells). I experienced it all. I also saw life in the camp without punitive isolation cells. It's no less difficult than in punitive isolation cells. It's hell for everyone there: for employees and for convicts. Of course, I suffered, and I suffered normally, but no more than other convicts.

Павялічыць

Pavel Spiryn in the Minsk City Court. Minsk, Belarus. February 5, 2021. Photo: Belsat

— Are you talking about everyone or about political prisoners?

— I don't distinguish between political and non-political — everyone suffered. Many non-political prisoners were abused in such a way that no political prisoner has yet suffered as much. This is all the work of the so-called generals and ministers who illegally appropriated their ranks and positions. Look, I was released, and I am supported by people not connected to the journalism profession, and by journalists, because I am political. When a person who has committed a real crime is released, whether it's theft, hooliganism, robbery — who is interested in him? No one. To whom can he complain?

Although they had no right to commit such acts against him, no one particularly raises this issue because he is a criminal. That's all.

“The zone is a mini-copy of the state”

Павялічыць

— When you were on trial, information emerged that other prisoners were forbidden from communicating with you. Is this true? How was your life organized in confinement?

— Apparently, when I first arrived at the penal colony, such a rumor spread. This is not true. This information was, let's say, accidentally disseminated. Everything was normal.

When I arrived at the penal colony, I had a choice: either accept the rules of life in the colony and live as everyone else does, or refuse to follow these rules and go to prison. I had no problems with the prisoners whatsoever. On the contrary. Even before I arrived at the colony, people already had information about who was coming. And they met me normally, they supported me.

The system there is built in such a way: you must live so as not to interfere with other people. So, I tried my best to ensure that no one had problems because of me.

— For what specific reason were you tried under Article 411 ("Malicious disobedience to the administration of a penal colony")?

— It's simple — the postponement of elections. The elections were postponed, and they were afraid to release me during that period as a threat to information security. They came, explained, and said: "Unfortunately, we do not have the right to release you."

— Did the penal colony affect you?

— The task I set for myself was to make a revolution. To make a revolution, one needs knowledge about the structure of society. This knowledge can be gained in the zone, because the zone is a mini-copy of the state. Or, if we take, for example, the Ministry of Education, to go from a teacher to a minister.

In Belarus, a person who goes from a teacher to a minister and becomes a minister of the Republic of Belarus at this moment is a scoundrel on whom there is no place left to put a brand. Therefore, such a path is not suitable. I chose a shorter path to gaining this knowledge — in the penal colony.

“An order came from the minister for us to make things difficult for you”

Павялічыць

Pre-trial Detention Center-7 in Brest, Belarus. The photo is for illustrative purposes. Photo: Belsat

— How was your access to information while in confinement? Did anything reach you about Russian aggression against Ukraine or the real state of affairs in Belarus?

— My access to information in the zone was excellent because I was informed by convicts and colony employees. Sometimes I visited the TV room, but very rarely, because it was propaganda. But when I needed to ascertain the truth, I listened to them, understanding that what they were saying was actually the opposite. Therefore, I am absolutely informed about the tragedy, Putin's fascist attack on Ukraine, and all other events. And I have a clear view on this, my further actions are clear.

— It's quite unusual to hear that even colony employees informed you of things.

— Many penal colony employees were subscribed to my channel and watched my films. They shared my convictions, so it was easier in that regard. It was more difficult because the person who illegally calls himself the Minister of Internal Affairs, Ivan Kubrakou, ordered me to be tormented.

— Personally?

— Of course, when he issued orders, colony employees would come to me and say, "Nikalaevich, an order came from the minister for us to make things difficult for you. We don't want to do that, so let's make it all look good, but only on paper." In most cases, that's what happened. I'm glad that I was warned about most provocations from the Ministry of Internal Affairs leadership, and there was an opportunity to avoid them with minimal losses.

Preventive supervision can be circumvented

— After your release, you spent a little over a month and a half free in Belarus. When and how did you decide that you would leave for Lithuania?

— I explicitly state that I was released to complete the revolution in the Republic of Belarus. A peaceful revolution without civil war. My task is not to allow citizen Lukashenka to drag our country into war.

In Belarus, for objective reasons, it is impossible to work towards my goal. Because anyone who acts actively in Belarus will be immediately arrested and placed in a penal colony. Therefore, it was necessary to temporarily leave the territory of my Homeland.

— Did you leave peacefully, or did you have to flee because the security forces monitor former political prisoners?

— As a lawyer, I know some loopholes in the legislation. I left "legally" (literally "in white"). After my release, I was under preventive supervision, which the court had ordered. This supervision imposes restrictions on me, which I ultimately used.

According to their [Belarusian authorities'. — Ed.] legislation, I am prohibited from leaving the district without permission from the internal affairs body. But upon changing residence, it is permissible to leave the district. I wrote a statement saying that I was changing my place of residence.

Legally, they could not refuse me, as it is my property, my home. I have the right to move into it. So they issued me a document with the Ministry of Internal Affairs seal, based on which I could leave my district. And as a result, I left both the district and the Republic of Belarus.

— Did you have any problems at the border?

— None.

“Alexander Ryhoravich is hated just as much”

Павялічыць

Pavel Spiryn before his detention. Photo: Nasha Niva

— In Belarus, life on the outside is just like in the zone. The zone is a mini-copy of the state. Alexander Ryhoravich has turned living in Belarus into a nightmare for most adequate citizens.

In 2025, wages at the country's largest enterprises sharply declined. Workers from these enterprises, whom I knew before my imprisonment, wrote to me.

Alexander Ryhoravich is hated just as much, even more so. The only difference is that the people fear war. The essence is that Alexander Ryhoravich is dragging us into this war, but when the time comes, his own actions will play a cruel joke on him. And we will finish, peacefully and without war, what we should have finished in 2020.

— How do you see the situation of Belarusians who have been pushed abroad?

— In the zone, unbearable conditions have been created for everyone: for convicts and for employees of internal affairs bodies. As a result, convicts and employees begin — I'll use a crude word — to devour each other, to snitch, to inform, to hate. Although, if you look closely, none of them wish each other ill.

Exactly in the same way, Alexander Ryhoravich is trying to create a situation abroad where Belarusians, who essentially have nothing against each other, end up being set against each other. So that difficult conditions force them to shift their focus from our real problem — Alexander Lukashenka — to other, much less significant problems. The entire task of Lukashenka and his entourage is to make enemies out of us.

— When you were arrested, there were no such stable structures abroad yet: no solidarity funds, no Tsikhanouskaya's Office, APK, and others. How do you feel, can we be proud of what we have, or was something done incorrectly?

— Everyone works to the best of their abilities. And first and foremost, everyone should try to evaluate their own activities independently. At the moment, I am only entering the information space, and once I better understand the situation, I will comment on it.

“I have concrete plans”

— You say that your further actions are clear to you. Also, in your first public statement after being free, you said that a revolution is needed, that we need to finish what we didn't finish in 2020. Do you have a vision for how to do this? Is it realistic now?

— Do not doubt, I have concrete plans. You will be acquainted with these plans. It has all already begun. You will all see a concrete plan and actions, without any vague phrases like "we are for all good things, against all bad things."

— Won't you share more details, even a little?

— Everything is step-by-step. Everything will be published on my YouTube channel and through journalists.

— In 2020, you were Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya's trustee in the elections and maintained a blog. You have now returned to blogging, but what other plans do you have? Will you, for example, join Tsikhanouskaya's team?

— Everyone who wishes to bring about changes in Belarus must do their work in their place. At the moment, I am in my place, and I am fulfilling the part of the work that society entrusts to me. Namely, I need to transmit the knowledge that society lacked in 2020. With the help of this knowledge, we will complete the processes that began then.

— In conclusion of our conversation, would you like to add anything else important?

— The system that Alexander Lukashenka created has devoured itself. It only remains to finish it off. I think many people have seen videos where generals report to Alexander Lukashenka about the readiness of troops for combat operations. To a specific question about whether the army is ready to fight and win, a pseudo-general, with a frightened, harassed look, tries to say that everything is fine using empty rhetoric. Moreover, he doesn't specifically answer the question of whether the soldiers are ready for war.

I think Lukashenka suspects that if he drags the country into war, soldiers will not go like sheep into "meat assaults," but will take up automatic weapons and begin, right on the battlefield or in troop deployment areas, to sentence and execute judgments against individuals who, having seized power in 2020, appropriated the ranks of colonels and generals for themselves. The people will not go into "meat assaults" for the sake of Lukashenka's sons' palaces.

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